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u/El_dorado_au Mar 26 '23
Farms in southern parts of USA: why do that, when undocumented immigrants are even cheaper?
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u/Nasty_nurds Mar 27 '23
Yeah cus there are so many American women fighting for more field hand jobs
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u/Lord_Derpington_ Mar 27 '23
Ben and Jerry’s: why do that when undocumented immigrant children are even cheaper?
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u/42CrMo4V Mar 27 '23
What about undocumented immigrant woman?
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u/Honato2 Mar 27 '23
their brother will probably shank you. At least in construction if you see a mexican lady on site her husband brother or cousin is there watching over her and they don't fuck around.
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u/GME_dat_puh Mar 27 '23
Yea but then you’d have women working for you and who needs that, am I right?
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u/Tallywhacker73 Mar 27 '23
I mean, what if they all started having their period at the same time of the month? It's totally impractical!
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u/TG1970 Mar 26 '23
I worked briefly for a company once that only hired men for the production floor. They had two men's restrooms and no women's restrooms for the production employees. The owner was a super creep and I was thrilled when I found another job and left.
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u/Dovahkiin106 Mar 27 '23
That lack of a women’s restroom was definitely lawsuit worthy(though they may be able to get out of it by making it unisex, I’m not totally sure what the legal requirements are).
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u/Nasty_nurds Mar 27 '23
If the production floor is 100% male employees i doubt it, she doesnt say there wasnt a restroom in the front office
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u/Legend-status95 Mar 27 '23
Depending on how many employees they have, 15 to 19 employees and you can discriminate based on age. 14 or less and everything but unequal pay based on gender is fair game. At least federally.
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u/halavais Mar 27 '23
Got my Ph.D. in 2001. Our department (in a large public university in a liberal city) had a faculty restroom--an anachronism in itself. It was a men's room.
There were, of course, men's and women's public restrooms in the building, but the faculty didn't see any problem with the "faculty" restroom being a men's room.
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u/Somewhereovertherai Mar 27 '23
Did no one say anything? Or were they like: making a whole new bathroom is expensive
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u/bbbriz Mar 27 '23
Omg, same. In my case, Inwas trying to be hired, and they gave me this excuse (Don't hire women, they don't have a bathroom).
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u/4948374748392737483 Mar 27 '23
Sounds like an easy lawsuit
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u/TG1970 Mar 27 '23
Probably. I just wanted out of there. I worked up front in the office where women were employed.
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u/CDXX_LXIL Mar 27 '23
There's a general bias and argument that is stated that statistics prove that women will often avoid working jobs, service, and general labor that is seen as unsanitary, physically demanding, or even outright dangerous. While I disagree that this is the case, I think there is merit to that claim. I've been working in industrial park jobs for 5 years and out of hundreds of people I've worked with, I've never seen a woman operate a forklift, a hyster, a pole driver, or machinery that wasn't under a direct position of a packer or operator.
I get it, people would rather work in comfortable positions, and it is possible to find work that is comfortable that also pays well. . . It's also possible to kill a tiger with your bare hands. If we could make more jobs like this, I wouldn't be working in industrial park, but that's about as likely as finding gold in the waters of California.
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u/heyuhitsyaboi Mar 27 '23
The company im at is odd too.
the main department and one supplementary department are all men, but then the other 50% of the company is all women
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u/HornedBowler Mar 27 '23
I worked at a small company that only had 1 female employee(a secretary) so the women's bathroom on the production floor was used for storage.
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u/WorldWestern1776 Mar 27 '23
How about instead of paying the women the same as the men, we pay the men the same as the women! More money by cutting everyone’s wages!
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u/RatatoskII Mar 27 '23
Businesses are gonna love that idea, you should send it to your favorite Congress member
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u/Timah158 Mar 27 '23
You know, money really seems to be the issue here. In the interest of fairness, we are deciding not to pay any of our employees effective immediately! No need to thank us.
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u/Naugatan Mar 27 '23
Yes, and then we can cut women’s pay because they shouldn’t make the same as men… repeat -> free labor. Source: I am a CFO and have an MBA
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u/notablyunfamous Mar 26 '23
The logic checks out.
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u/Johnnyamaz Mar 27 '23
There's a term called pink collar jobs. Healthcare and education workers are highly female dominated and probably the two most underpaid sectors in our country.
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u/Shiningc Mar 27 '23
Here in Japan the vast majority of part time jobs are mostly women. It's an entire economy based on exploitation of cheap female labor.
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u/DavisLaurelAlt2 Mar 27 '23
Healthcare workers and teachers don't make a lot of money for male or female. With the exception of higher educated positions respective to in those fields
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u/curatedcliffside Mar 27 '23
That’s bc they’re female dominated. Look at programming for another example- back when they thought programming was low-value and tedious, it was considered women’s work, and it was lower paid. Once software development became more prestigious, men began to dominate the workforce and wages went up.
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u/AskMeAboutMyTie Mar 27 '23
education
No wonder our kids are so fucked up! It’s a women industry! Let’s replace them all with men and cure cancer!
/s
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u/guyonghao004 Mar 27 '23
Emm if we are seriously explaining there are two underlying assumptions - (1) cost is the sole priority of hiring decisions; (2) the perceived value of a man and a woman is the same to corporations.
Neither are true.
Today’s corporation hires less woman and pays them less because they think woman are less capable because you can’t do an office job, clicking mouse and stare at Excels without a penis.
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u/Whatyourlookingfor Mar 27 '23
Today’s corporation hires less woman and pays them less because they think woman are less capable because you can’t do an office job, clicking mouse and stare at Excels without a penis.
Really? I'd love to see some stats on that. I would've suspected the total opposite.
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u/EffectiveDependent38 Mar 27 '23
But we have statistics that say that companies pay men and women the same amount for the same office jobs, including clicking a mouse and staring at Excel.
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u/Soepoelse123 Mar 27 '23
Except it doesn’t. Culturally, men are valued higher as a worker, meaning that they will outcompete women for better paid jobs - not because of better results, but higher evaluation. That puts female workers in a position of systematically having to take worse paid positions.
It’s especially apparent in more chauvinist countries, but its also a factor for western countries. It traces back to a time where certain jobs were taken by the main provider, meaning that they would demand a higher pay - just like the women (and men) in the professions that haven’t developed strong wage structures, has to fight for higher wages now.
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u/ThatTubaGuy03 Mar 27 '23 edited Mar 27 '23
Studies have shown that for men and women with the same level of experience in the same field doing the same job, the pay gap basically doesn't exist.
https://www.payscale.com/research-and-insights/gender-pay-gap/
TL;DR of the article, there is the uncontrolled wage gap, which is just comparing what the average man makes in comparison to what the average woman makes. This is where you get the 70-80% of what men makes stats. The controlled wage gap is what I said above, which says women make 99% of men, which is basically even
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u/DatGoofyGinger Mar 27 '23
"Both the uncontrolled and controlled gap are important for understanding how society values women. The uncontrolled gap, sometimes called the opportunity gap, is an indication of what types of jobs — and associated earnings — are occupied by women overall versus men overall. This in turn is an indicator of how wealth and power are gendered and that women’s roles are often less valued within our society."
Direct quote from the article you posted. There are a lot of other excerpts as well that show that while the controlled gap is minimal, there are several other inequitable factors that impact women's salaries. A big one is the rate of promotion. So while yes, controlling for a factor like having the same job shows making almost the same pay, it's not showing that women are less likely to get promoted at all.
Tl:Dr - I would say you oversimplified what the article is saying.
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u/A_H_S_99 Mar 27 '23
I think this points to the fact that women need to have more promotion opportunities, but this leaves the question of why these opportunities aren't as available to them in the first place and whether there are social factors that make them unavailable?
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u/Pixilatedlemon Mar 27 '23
There absolutely are issues based on gender that are holding women back from climbing the ladder so to speak. I wish this was the way the conversation was framed because I genuinely know people that think that even if you control for position and hours worked, women make significantly less and it’s just false and would call for solutions to the wrong problems
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u/Beardsman528 Mar 27 '23
There was some research at some point that claimed that women were much less likely to be confrontational and less likely to push for promotions.
Not sure how good the research was, I'll have to find out again.
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u/Paaraadox Mar 27 '23
This is however also an oversimplification, because it's not how society values women, per se. The industries that are female dominated (education, health care, elderly care etc.) are not production industries. They are essentially necessary costs for a working society, but it's not generating income. Being a good teacher doesn't make a school more money, in the way a good engineer or salesman will significantly increase the revenue of a private company in the STEM field, for example.
Society is always going to try to have the costs of those industries as low as possible. It is not because there are mostly women working there, it's because there is no money to be had in those industries.
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u/Whys0_o Mar 27 '23
Then perhaps we should look at profit as not the best measure of societal value
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u/ThatTubaGuy03 Mar 27 '23
Thank you for adding further contact, mine probably was too brief for how complex of a topic it is
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u/CapableDistance5570 Mar 27 '23
Basically this is a good meme, I've yet to encounter someone that doesn't make that face and then having nothing good to say.
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u/TheHighWarlord Mar 27 '23
Studies have shown that for men and women with the same level of experience in the same field doing the same job, the pay gap basically doesn't exist.
No, they show the opposite, that a gap still clearly exists.
which says women make 99% of men, which is basically even
No, it's not 1% wage gap, it's closer to 5%-8%.
"For instance, after accounting for college major, occupation, economic sector, hours worked, months unemployed since graduation, GPA, type of undergraduate institution, institution selectivity, age, geographical region, and marital status, AAUW found a remaining 7 percent difference between the earnings of male and female college graduates one year after graduation. That gap jumped to 12 percent 10 years after college graduation (AAUW, 2012; AAUW Educational Foundation, 2007)"
https://www.aauw.org/app/uploads/2020/02/AAUW-2018-SimpleTruth-nsa.pdf
and
"In the full specification, the adjusted ratio (91.6 percent) remained considerably higher than in the human capital specification (82.1 percent) in 2011, suggesting a continued substantial role for occupation and industry in explaining the gender wage gap" http://ftp.iza.org/dp9656.pdf
In this second study, when the full specification of covariates is considered, women still make 8% less than men.
and
"The mean salary within our cohort was $167 669 (95% CI, $158 417-$176 922) for women and $200 433 (95% CI, $194 249-$206 617) for men. Male gender was associated with higher salary (+$13 399; P = .001) even after adjustment in the final model for specialty, academic rank, leadership positions, publications, and research time. Peters-Belson analysis (use of coefficients derived from regression model for men applied to women) indicated that the expected mean salary for women, if they retained their other measured characteristics but their gender was male, would be $12 194 higher than observed. " https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/1182859
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u/ThatTubaGuy03 Mar 27 '23
Welp, we both quoted seeming trustworthy sources that say different things, I don't know where to go from here. Maybe your researchers can fight my researchers for dominance and the last researcher standing is correct.
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u/jimothythe2nd Mar 27 '23
Men make more money because:
1) men work more
2) men will take jobs that most women will not take (which makes men much more likely to be injured or killed on the job)
3) men on average choose higher paying professions
Even though they earn less money, 80% of consumer spending is done by or for women. The ladies still get all the money somehow anyways.
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u/Rissoto_Pose Mar 27 '23
Do men choose higher paying professions or are male dominated Professions just paid more than female dominated ones. Im feeling it’s the second
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u/Skeptic_Sinner Mar 27 '23
Even adjusted, according to wikipedia there still is a 5% wage gap
Even though they earn less money, 80% of consumer spending is done by or for women. The ladies still get all the money somehow anyways.
So let's lower the pay for women to make up for that? Wtf is this argument
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u/Kweschunner Mar 27 '23
Ummm hate to say it this makes a lot of sense . Logically sound
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u/Tyko_777 Mar 27 '23
why don’t they?
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u/Blooberdydoo Mar 27 '23
Because women making less than men is very misleading. The same position in the same company, hiring 2 people at the same time is going to pay the same regardless of gender, unless one of them negotiates a higher salary.
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u/AsainOboist Mar 27 '23
thought this was on r/politicalcompassmemes for a second and honestly it fits right in
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u/yourdededone Mar 26 '23
I mean, they're right.
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u/DreamedJewel58 Mar 27 '23 edited Mar 27 '23
“If these companies are discriminatory, why aren’t they hiring more of the group they’re discriminating against? Checkmate liberals”
Companies used to pay black Americans much less than white Americans, but they were almost always fired so a white person could take their place. This “comeback” just doesn’t make sense when you use any critical thinking skills about why they’re being paid less
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u/meatmaster1123 Mar 27 '23
Is the CEO of every single company racist? Surely not, if the wage gap is actually significant accounting for all variables there would be at least a dozen non-discriminatory companies taking advantage by hiring all women.
I find it hard to believe that every single company is discriminatory enough that they would rather put women down than make free money. The reality is probably a multi-factorial issue, different career choices, working hours, and having to deal with pregnancy.
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u/SirSeanBeanTheBean Mar 27 '23
if the wage gap is actually significant accounting for all variables there would be at least a dozen non-discriminatory companies taking advantage by hiring all women.
The meme is asking “If companies who pay women less because they think women are less performant, why don’t they hire more women?”
Those are based on two different beliefs somehow co-existing in the same company. If they believe women are cheaper because they’re less performant then you need to hire more women than men for equal performance and ultimately equal money. It doesn’t solve anything.
And you’re asking “If companies know women are equally performant, why don’t they pay them less anyway?”
I’m sure some do but it takes a special type of evil to partake in something you actually acknowledge to be wrong and unfair. In most cases those two different beliefs can’t coexist.
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u/iGetBuckets3 Mar 27 '23
What is your evidence that companies are discriminating against women?
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u/superstonkape Mar 27 '23
They don’t have any. Studies over and over have supported the fact that men and women make nearly identical salaries in the same positions, as that would make sense. The current wage gap is entirely based on what jobs men and women choose to do.
Men make up 96? percents of workplace deaths. We don’t talk about a death gap or that we need to make a point that workplaces are safer for men, because men choose these jobs that are more dangerous and that’s understood.
Women are most of the educated adults in the US these days too, or at least are becoming more so. I want to say it’s somewhere in the range of 50-60/40-50 in favor of women in universities these days, and if nursing is included in STEM (it should be) women are roughly 50% there today too. Circumstances and decisions are the reason for a ‘wage gap’, not discrimination.
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u/EffectiveDependent38 Mar 27 '23
Companies used to pay black Americans much less than white Americans, but they were almost always fired so a white person could take their place.
Gonna need a source on that. Corpos are and have always been cheapos when it comes to labor. If black people were replaced by white people and the company ended up paying more on labor because of racism I suspect that the company wouldn't last much longer. On the other hand, I suspect that what really happened was that they just underhanded the white person coming as replacement and paid them the same amount.
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u/DreamedJewel58 Mar 27 '23 edited Mar 27 '23
“Last hired, first fired”
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/25/opinion/sunday/race-wage-gap.html
If you skimmed a single book about America’s history of racial inequality you’d already know this. When white people went off to fight wars or experience a lack in the labor force, companies would hire black workers for cheap until the white people came back and fired them
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u/EffectiveDependent38 Mar 27 '23 edited Mar 27 '23
How do those sources contradict what I said? They replaced black labor with white labor when white people became unemployed/during market crashes (i.e. during the Great Depression) and they could cheaply replace it by paying white people the same amount. This way they were able to maintain profit margins and still show the public that "black people aren't taking white jobs" anymore or something similar.
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u/FTR_1077 Mar 27 '23
I've seen plenty of manufacturing sites where about 90% of the work force are women.. not in the US though.
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u/GiantRetortoise Mar 27 '23
I mean, anyone who did that would be tacitly admitting the wage disparity is real, and their rank exploitation would be wildly unpopular
Are you a fuckin idiot
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u/CapableDistance5570 Mar 27 '23
Not really, look at all the woke companies that hire more women. I've never seen them get criticized for taking advantage of the wage gap.
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u/Blazic24 Mar 27 '23
trying to explain more fully:
wage gap is not decided consciously. when one thinks of a fair wage for their new employee, they Happen to lowball women. this relates to the subconscious perception that a woman cannot preform so well as a man could. thus, its not a logistical consideration, but a case where one cause creates multiple results.
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u/Quanchivious Mar 27 '23
This is not true. Companies don’t actively lowball women. Women make less on average because they raise children at a much higher % than men and their careers take a setback. Multiply that by millions of women and you get lower average pay when running the #’s.
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u/Nasty_nurds Mar 27 '23
Is that perception or reality? I work in sales where you only make what you earn. Weirdly enough its male dominated.
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u/Elocorem Mar 27 '23
They don't hire only women because women aren't paid less than men for the same job.
The wage gap is not actually a wage gap but an earnings gap. If you actually look into how the gender wage gap is calculated you will find it is just the ratio between the median amount of money earned by all full-time men and women in a year regardless of occupation.
The only thing the "wage gap" proves is that most women have lower paying jobs than most men. Unfortunately is has been misconstrued by the media to make it sound like women are facing blatant discrimination in the workplace by getting paid ~20% less than a man for the exact same job which is false.
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u/ETROL2 Mar 27 '23
reminder to always share how much you are getting payed with other coworkers
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u/Lemontek_720 Mar 26 '23
Because it’s not true, there is not a wage gap in a like for like role with someone of like for like experience/skill level.
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u/Dovahkiin106 Mar 27 '23
Yeah, the 70¢ stat at the very least is garbage. I challenge anyone that reads this to find a source that uses that statistic that mentions Asians. The reason they never do is because the study they got that stat from shows that on average, Asian men AND women make more than white men.
Point is, that stat is based on overall average earnings, and has literally nothing to do with same job/work/position, but the people that use it use it out of context to make the wage gap look bigger than it really is, if there even is a significant gap.
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u/iamthefluffyyeti Mar 27 '23
https://www.dol.gov/sites/dolgov/files/WB/media/Evaluation-Gender-Wage-Gap-Executive-Summary.pdf
Unexplained gap of 12%-15%
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u/Dovahkiin106 Mar 27 '23
Well done, an article that actually takes into account same job rather than overall average salary. A far more reliable statistic to work with.
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u/Eating_moths Mar 26 '23
I was a GM for three years, my bf at the time applied to be a GM with the same company different location, no management experience at all nor education like I had. He was offered 30% more than I was already making three years in 😑
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u/Blooberdydoo Mar 27 '23
That's common regardless of gender. That's why those who can and do change jobs every 2-3 years end up making 50% more money by the end of their career.
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u/Few-Statistician8740 Mar 27 '23
My wife earns more than all her male colleagues, they all have similar education, and she has the least work experience out of all of them ( by virtue of age )
The women earn 75 cents on the dollar statistic always tossed around is full of issues.
It made no distinction between full time and part time, years worked, years of experience and overtime.
It's also very common for new hires in the same role to earn more these days. It's the entire basis of the great resignation, people left jobs for similar jobs elsewhere that paid better. New hires that fill the now vacant roll earned more than their replacement.
Some companies have the forethought to understand it's less expensive and disruptive to keep existing employees, that perform well, paid appropriately for the labor market. Other companies don't.
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u/PseudoKirby Mar 27 '23
If you break down statistics between similar jobs and industries the wage gap is only about 1 - 3% on average, some industries are higher and some are negative percentages
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u/Eating_moths Mar 27 '23
That’s a great perspective! I didn’t really think about the whole new hire thing. He was a pizza delivery driver and had absolutely no experience or qualifications to even get the job 🥲 the VP found him attractive (i think) and offered him more than he could handle. This was really my only experience. I made more than another male employee, similar location, same position. I think the company was pretty shady(?) and extremely inconsistent
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u/JazzJackets9090 Mar 27 '23
It’s rare they find the man attractive haha
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u/Few-Statistician8740 Mar 27 '23
I got my first job because the manager thought I was attractive. The only guys she hired were ones she found attractive. Every one of us had an awkward story about her hitting on us, more than a few took her up on her advances.
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u/flaks117 Mar 27 '23
Every job offers incentives to recruit new people. If your bf had been working first they would have been offering you the same 30% increase in all likelihood.
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u/Lemontek_720 Mar 26 '23
What was the difference in the locations? Not only location, but size/revenue/staff/tables per hour average/etc? I worked as a GM and then DM for Papa John’s (different but not that different) over a decade ago and all those things matter in what they pay. The chick who had zero experience and I was 5 years in a GM role got hired into a busy store and made almost double what I did.
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u/Eating_moths Mar 27 '23
My store went from #15 to #1 in regional sales. I was performing pretty well. His store was underperforming due to previous management 🤷♀️ it was just weird. He ended up getting fired a month later haha
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u/PursueGood Mar 27 '23
Places will pay as little as they can to anyone. As a man I’ve had new hires start at or above my wage, I assume simply because they had higher self esteem and requested that wage initially.
After learning a new hire who I was responsible for supervising started at my current wage I requested a raise. I was met with resistance and informed if the increased expectations they would have of me. So I just walked out.
It’s not about your sex it’s about whether you were taught to value yourself correctly. If an employer senses you have low self worth, male or female they will take advantage of it.
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u/KingfisherDays Mar 27 '23
This is not that unusual though. It's normal for new hires to make more than people who stick with one company. They take advantage and don't pay the market rate for people who are already there.
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u/Frosty_Window_1978 Mar 27 '23
Isn't it against the law to pay women less money?
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u/HowManyNamesAreFree Mar 27 '23
It being illegal is not a way to determine whether or not it happens. If you found me standing over a dead body with a bloody knife, you would probably not find "I can't have done it because murder is illegal" a good argument. Also many workplaces have proven they don't actually care about these sorts of laws by doing illegal things like telling people not to discuss salaries, or wage theft, or punishing unions.
Now to be clear, I don't know enough to discuss the actual gap situation, just wanted to point out that that specific argument doesn't really work.
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u/gnarlycarly18 Mar 27 '23 edited Mar 27 '23
On paper, yes, the wage gap is illegal. This doesn’t mean employers are paying women fairly. This also doesn’t mean that women in general aren’t paid less than men and have less capital due to a myriad of social factors. This isn’t a good argument, companies get away with doing illegal shit all the time. Whether it’s an issue of people not being well informed of their rights or their incapability of bringing forth a lawsuit, “it’s illegal” is not a good argument.
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u/barugosamaa Mar 27 '23
Yup. It's illegal.
The "gap" is because they are comparing in general.
Wage Gap bs is like me saying
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u/lexicats Mar 27 '23
No it’s more like - “feminine” careers like teaching and nursing are paid a lot less than “masculine” careers like banking and policing.
Also women are less likely to be considered for promotions. Also have to stop their career to care for children and often can’t catch up to male counterparts.
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u/Humble-Principle1858 Mar 27 '23
I'm amazed by the comments I see here. I was under the impression that the pay gap had been so indisputably refuted that nobody -except the people consumed by ideology - would have a problem understanding this meme. I know this is Reddit, but I expected more.
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Mar 27 '23
Imma be real there are wage gaps all over the place, women just happen to get more of them. I’ve met MANY women paid more than men for the same shit. But I’ve also met just as many men paid more for the same shit. The best you can do is call it out and threaten to report it
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u/jerflash Mar 27 '23
This meme is correct. The wage gap everyone refers to is not when men and women work the same job. That wage gap occurs because men and women choose different jobs…
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u/AE10304 Mar 27 '23
LOL What's the matter..... don't have the balls to ask for a bigger salary?
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u/Corndog1911 Mar 27 '23
The wage gap is a myth. The earnings gap is not.
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u/Flip5ide Mar 27 '23
Are you talking like difference in hours? Because I would be very surprised if women worked more hours than men on average. But that's not really saying anything crazy.
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u/Corndog1911 Mar 27 '23
When controlled for all factors, women are paid about 99 cents to a man's dollar. This means women in the same position as men will make the same amount of money. Men tend to work more hours and choose higher paying jobs. Women also take maternity leave which impacts overall earnings. If you take the average amount that a man makes and compare it to the average that a woman makes, there is a sizeable gap but it's not because of sexism. Its different lifestyle and career choices.
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u/DKAlm
Mar 27 '23
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Because the pay disparity happens due to prevalent bias that exists on an individual level, and not by an actual unwritten policy that says "women get paid less lol". If they started hiring only women they would also get slapped by sex discrimination lawsuits. There are also other factors that contribute to the gap that exist outside of the direct influence of individual workplaces, like the overwhelming pressure forced onto women to be the ones to take care of children and chores, and the rampant misogyny that exists in high paying fields that cause women to be pushed out and into more women dominated fields that are payed less. Why are gender pay gap deniers still stuck on poorly thought out 2014 talking points?
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u/_KRN0530_ Mar 27 '23
There are 100s of women only run and operated businesses. There have also been a couple of shows that have released with women only writing teams. Not saying that there’s anything wrong with that but it isn’t uncommon or illegal.
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u/curatedcliffside Mar 27 '23
Intentionally hiring by gender is illegal, I believe it runs afoul of Title VII. There are exceptions to this rule, though. If promoting women is part of the mission of the organization, or if gender is important to the job (ex. Hooter’s), they’ll meet the exception.
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u/No_Quote600 Mar 27 '23
Some jobs pay more than others, if women choose to not work high paying jobs that is not men's fault.
Most women in 2023 would prefer not working on an oil rig or working with solid waste or working in a mine, that isn't men's fault. Men didn't push women away from those jobs, the nature of the work did.
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u/DKAlm Mar 27 '23
Except a lot of those jobs are not particularly high paying either, and those jobs are notoriously discriminatory against women. Women in those jobs experience extremely high rates of sexual abuse and workplace hostility. Example:
Also who is saying its men's fault? Thats the problem with ylu people, you think everything is about you. It's not men's fault, it's the fault of society and the attitudes that exist within it that force unfair pressures on men and women on the basis of gender, like how women are overwhelmingly expected to do virtually all of the housework while also working a full time job, for example.
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u/lost_jw Mar 27 '23
I actually don't think this fits here, women and men are equal by law.
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u/Broad_Respond_2205 Mar 27 '23
If someone ever try to robs you - just say no. They aren't allowed to rob you without your consent.
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u/Guilty_Chemistry9337 Mar 27 '23
People break the law. What a dumb argument.
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u/MyPythonObject Mar 27 '23
There are countless lawyers willing to take those cases for free. It's an easy win. The wage gap literally does not exist.
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u/4948374748392737483 Mar 27 '23
Yeah the 78/100 figure doesn’t take into account men working more hours on average or them being several times more likely to die in the workplace or anything like that
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u/ConcernedRobot Mar 27 '23
Wage gap is a debunked lie used to justify feminism after it turned into a hate movement. I honestly didn’t think anyone bought this leftist misinformation anymore.
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u/lost_jw Mar 27 '23
Sometimes, but big companies can't get away with it.
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u/Elder_Hoid Mar 27 '23
Which world have you been living in? I'm pretty sure it's only the big companies that get away with this.
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u/Delicatestatesmen Mar 27 '23
Most human resources are women so they are responsible for women getting lower pay. Women vs women.
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u/Just-Ad-5972 Mar 27 '23
Women don't get paid less for the same position with the same qualifications. If you experience that, feel free to sue the employer.
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u/A_Salty_Cellist Mar 27 '23
Women get paid slightly less than men when they are in the same positions, but there are a lot of industries (restaurant, tech, and medical to name a few) that discriminate heavily against women meaning it's a lot harder to actually get into those same positions, regardless of skill or qualifications. It's not as simple as "women get paid less for the same job"
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u/ghostofwinter88 Mar 27 '23
I work for a big medical device company.
To say that 'medical' discriminates heavily against women is BS.
There is almost no difference in numbers of male vs female doctors among our customers. Males might dominate certain sectors (orthopedics, for example, where you do actually need some strength) but it skews back in other disciplines (O&G, paediatrics, and women's health) Nursing is almost exclusively female, while hospital porters are overwhelmingly male.
Our sales staff is overwhelmingly female, marketing and customer relations too (this is almost certainly the industry standard) . The traditional Engineering disciplines are more male dominated but females are heavily represented in anything biology and chemistry related.
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u/HalensVan Mar 27 '23
Lol this sub has a real hard time understanding statistics...while quoting them.
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u/Freedombuy Mar 27 '23
Imagine still believing in the wage gap
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u/KoKotod Mar 27 '23
shhh dont say things like that on this sub. you wil get downvoted to oblivion, but yes WAGE GAP ISNT REAL !
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u/OverworkedLemon Mar 27 '23 edited Mar 27 '23
It's actually correct.
I know it's not a great thing to hear but it is objectively correct. As a Data Consultant and a Statistician. If you dig one level deeper on "Why they are paid less?".
The answer makes complete objective sense and it is difficult to argue it is unfair based on evidence. But some industries can be easier to produce evidence for.
I would agree there is some form of discrimination involved but if there is discrimination involved it can be reasonably difficult to detect.
I'm not saying they should be paid less. I'm just saying that they are and there are reasons outside of gender discrimination alone that provides strong objective reasoning that though there is inequality - it's not obvious that it is because of discrimination.
So unfortunately, that smart-ass question about "why don't they just hire women to save money?" is because they can't. The person is unfortunately correct, even if he is an asshole about it.
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u/Itaminoai Mar 27 '23
Because then nothing would get done on time. (This is a joke don’t hate bomb me please)
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u/350ADay Mar 27 '23
Feminists hate that meme and the question because there is no response, the meme is true.
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u/colorless_green_idea Mar 27 '23
Exactly. The pay gap of ~60 cents to the dollar (I forget the specific number) is explained by differences in careers pursued by men vs women. When you account for same work, the gap closes to ~95 cents on the dollar (mostly men are usually more willing to ask for more)
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u/curatedcliffside Mar 27 '23
The meme sucks. Part of the reason for the wage gap is that women work lower wage jobs. The majority of minimum wage workers are women. This is a bad thing for society bc many of these women have kids and are the sole or primary breadwinner of their households. You should care about that.
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u/blue-to-grey Mar 27 '23
They assume that if a woman is unmarried she will get married and need to take time off for wedding planning and arrangements, which typically falls on the bride, and the honeymoon.
If the woman is already married they assume that she'll want to start a family which means time off for prenatal appointments, labor, and maternity leave in addition to possibly spiking their health insurance premiums for those reasons.
If a woman already has kids they'll assume that she is the primary caregiver and need to take time off if kids sick, for medical appointments, or school functions in addition to their own care.
Even if a woman's children are older or grown but she's had to take time off for medical appointments, maternity leave, children being sick and medical appointments, the year or so off that some parent's take due to the high cost of childcare - all of these factors have impacted her career progression throughout her life. Raises, promotions, and time in the workforce are all weighted as hiring qualifications. This means that even when women are old enough that employers are no longer concerned about work/life balance, women are competing against men who usually have had wives to handle all those previously mentioned needs.
Posting this elsewhere as well.
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u/ethanator329 Mar 27 '23
Isn’t a large part of the wage gap just from Women being less often considered for advancement? Women not being recognized for their talents, leadership, and anything more than what they do in their current role certainly seems much more realistic than “I can get away with paying women less”.
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u/Danceswithdisaster Mar 27 '23
I read a while back that there is something involving negotiation too. Women are less likely to ask for raises or promotions, and requests are more likely to be received negatively if they do
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u/Frostiron_7 Mar 27 '23
Are you kidding? This is a great meme. Shush off to your Westboro Baptist crypt or wherever creatures like you dwell.
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u/DirtyArchaeologist Mar 27 '23
I just hope that somewhere out there there is an all women owned and women run business that uses this as their justification for why they won't allow men to work there. It's just capitalism, not discrimination, men are just too expensive to the bottom line.
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u/cosmicannoli Mar 27 '23
"If I pretend like nobody has a counterpoint to my really really specious and disingenuous claim, I can make it look like there isn't one!"
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u/vlsdo Mar 27 '23
I mean, they do. Child care, elder care, social work, etc have overwhelmingly female employees, and some of the lowest pay out there.
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u/Flip5ide Mar 27 '23
But that's not because these companies are only hiring women. This is because no woman (generally) wants to make a living as an electrician or a race car driver.
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u/vlsdo Mar 27 '23
It's more that men don't usually take low paying/high stress jobs like childcare when they can do something else that's more lucrative
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u/yayapfool Mar 27 '23 edited Mar 27 '23
Women are actually paid more, for the same work (by a negligible amount); but women work lower paying jobs on average than men.
I'm not sure why this subject is still so misrepresented in pop culture. It's not like accepting the truth is somehow...anti-feminist, or something. It is its own problem that women end up in lower-paying jobs; it doesn't need to be spun to make it sound like women are paid in a sexist way.
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u/rithfung Mar 27 '23
Consider a workplace discriminate women by paid less, do you think they want to hire more women?
Let me rephrase, do you think a workplace full of discrimination, want to hire more people they discriminate?
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u/QualityVote Mar 26 '23
Hey does this post fit? UPVOTE if so, DOWNVOTE if not. If this post breaks any rules please DOWNVOTE and REPORT
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u/QualityVote Mar 27 '23
/u/info-warz, the memers have spoken. Your post does not fit this subreddit. If you feel this was a mistake, please send us a modmail!